Computershare
Roy,
Thanks. That is what I'm thinking. I'm going to call E.J. on Monday and see if they can transfer my shares without a fee. I've always been told the cheapest way isn't always the best. You get what you pay for. Don't think this is worth all my frustration and time. I can pick up the phone or go by the office and get my questions answered, unlike Computershare. Also I buy stock from Computershare and mail my stock buy and check in and by the time they get it the price has changed so sometimes it costs us more.
I appreciate everyone's advice.
Lorna
Sent from my iPhone
I've been intrigued by the string of emails. I understand everybody saying dump EJ and go with TDA, and I would normally agree. (I use TDA myself and in one club.) But, until the Silver Medallion situation is rectified, I would stay with a more full-service broker like EJ and try to get it to acquire the shares that are locked up in CompuServe. When I've changed brokers before, the incoming broker handled everything. I would be surprised if EJ can't handle the transfer. Then that club can reevaluate and see which broker is best for them.
Thank you,Roy Chastain"The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place." George Bernard Shaw
On Mar 16, 2019, at 11:27 AM, Bob Mann via bivio.com <user*12614800001@bivio.com> wrote:Wow. Has your club added up its brokerage costs for the last year? Is she really worth all that money? What is she doing that's so spectacular, may I ask? Have you considered any other broker that charges $10 or less per trade.
Your club, your money, your decision.
Bob
Bu j y ,g
-------- Original message --------
From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>
Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] Computershare
Whoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.
All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.
Peter Dunkelberger
Sumner Stock Selectors Investment Club
Bob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.Linda Glein
Peter
What did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I'm sorry. You may not know that if you haven't done it but asking just in case you know
Thanks for the info.
Lorna
Sent from my iPhone
Bu j y ,g-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareWhoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment ClubBob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.Linda Glein
I'm 70. What in hell, does that mean?
On March 16, 2019 at 5:36 PM "jacks2@charter.net via bivio.com" <user*29159500001@bivio.com> wrote:
Bu j y ,g-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)To: club_cafe@bivio.comSubject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareWhoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment Club
Virus-free. www.avg.com Bob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.Linda Glein
I suspect that it has nothing to do with your age or technical knowledge.
I think it is gibberish, like a butt dial.
Peter
I'm 70. What in hell, does that mean?
On March 16, 2019 at 5:36 PM "jacks2@charter.net via bivio.com" <user*29159500001@bivio.com> wrote:
Bu j y ,g-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareWhoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment Club
Virus-free. www.avg.com Bob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.Linda Glein
Hi Lorna,
I profess ignorance about the "silver medallion". Except I do know that banks use them as one step up from a notary public certification.
We were with Scottrade for years and they were bought by TD Ameritrade, so the transfer was "semi-seamless". It seems from I have read that the Silver Medallion is Computershare's requirement, is that correct? If it is a requirement of Edward Jones, then I cannot guess what TD Ameritrade would want. Even with the purchase of Scottrade by TD Ameritrade, we still had to fill out the partnership paperwork, mainly because our partnership officer elections happened at the same time. But once you are working with TD Ameritrade, the online services are automatically available. Nothing we did or do with TD Ameritrade has required more than signatures of the partners. We had to appoint a "trading partner", the appointment of whom required a copy of the meeting minutes reflecting that appointment. The initial set up with TD Ameritrade is somewhat tedious and requires a lot of reading and talking to TD Ameritrade to make certain what information they actually want on what line. After that it is simplicity defined.
I would suggest you call TD Ameritrade and see what they say. Whatever they require will be easier and cheaper than what you are going through now.
Peter Dunkelberger
PeterWhat did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I'm sorry. You may not know that if you haven't done it but asking just in case you knowThanks for the info.LornaSent from my iPhoneBu j y ,g-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareWhoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment ClubBob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.Linda Glein
Thanks Peter! I will.
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
Lorna
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Saturday, March 16, 2019, 7:29 PM, Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com <user*26984900001@bivio.com> wrote:
Hi Lorna,I profess ignorance about the "silver medallion". Except I do know that banks use them as one step up from a notary public certification.We were with Scottrade for years and they were bought by TD Ameritrade, so the transfer was "semi-seamless". It seems from I have read that the Silver Medallion is Computershare's requirement, is that correct? If it is a requirement of Edward Jones, then I cannot guess what TD Ameritrade would want. Even with the purchase of Scottrade by TD Ameritrade, we still had to fill out the partnership paperwork, mainly because our partnership officer elections happened at the same time. But once you are working with TD Ameritrade, the online services are automatically available. Nothing we did or do with TD Ameritrade has required more than signatures of the partners. We had to appoint a "trading partner", the appointment of whom required a copy of the meeting minutes reflecting that appointment. The initial set up with TD Ameritrade is somewhat tedious and requires a lot of reading and talking to TD Ameritrade to make certain what information they actually want on what line. After that it is simplicity defined.I would suggest you call TD Ameritrade and see what they say. Whatever they require will be easier and cheaper than what you are going through now.Peter DunkelbergerPeterWhat did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I'm sorry. You may not know that if you haven't done it but asking just in case you knowThanks for the info.LornaSent from my iPhoneBu j y ,g-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareWhoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment ClubBob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.Linda Glein
I didn't know what a silver medallion is so I looked it up. It is "
A stamp that is used to guarantee that a signature is genuine. It can be obtained at most large commercial banks or brokerage houses. The institution authenticating assumes financial liability if the signature is not genuine. A medallion guarantee is required on all written transfer instructions."
John Rice
Thanks Peter! I will.Lorna
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhoneOn Saturday, March 16, 2019, 7:29 PM, Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com <user*26984900001@bivio.com> wrote:
Hi Lorna,I profess ignorance about the "silver medallion". Except I do know that banks use them as one step up from a notary public certification.We were with Scottrade for years and they were bought by TD Ameritrade, so the transfer was "semi-seamless". It seems from I have read that the Silver Medallion is Computershare's requirement, is that correct? If it is a requirement of Edward Jones, then I cannot guess what TD Ameritrade would want. Even with the purchase of Scottrade by TD Ameritrade, we still had to fill out the partnership paperwork, mainly because our partnership officer elections happened at the same time. But once you are working with TD Ameritrade, the online services are automatically available. Nothing we did or do with TD Ameritrade has required more than signatures of the partners. We had to appoint a "trading partner", the appointment of whom required a copy of the meeting minutes reflecting that appointment. The initial set up with TD Ameritrade is somewhat tedious and requires a lot of reading and talking to TD Ameritrade to make certain what information they actually want on what line. After that it is simplicity defined.I would suggest you call TD Ameritrade and see what they say. Whatever they require will be easier and cheaper than what you are going through now.Peter DunkelbergerPeterWhat did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I'm sorry. You may not know that if you haven't done it but asking just in case you knowThanks for the info.LornaSent from my iPhoneBu j y ,g-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareWhoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment ClubBob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.Linda Glein
We had used Computershare for years for a number of stocks for years. It was convenient when they allowed online access and building a portfolio. About 7-8 years ago they disallowed online access for partnerships, so I transferred each of them to the
club's TDAmeritrade account. It was painless going through the TDA direct transfer process. It was made easier that the account names were mostly similar. No need for Silver Medallion or any other BS.
At this point we do not have any accounts with any TA (Transfer agent). TDA is much easier during tax time and having one place to go for transactions.
I still utilize Computershare for some of my personal stocks, but am slowing transferring those to my TDA account as well when Computershare "improves" their accounts with added fees.
mgk
From: club_cafe@bivio.com <club_cafe@bivio.com> on behalf of LORNA DUCK via bivio.com <user*22851200001@bivio.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2019 1:03 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] Computershare
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2019 1:03 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] Computershare
Thanks Peter! I will.
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
Lorna
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Saturday, March 16, 2019, 7:29 PM, Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com <user*26984900001@bivio.com> wrote:
Hi Lorna,I profess ignorance about the "silver medallion". Except I do know that banks use them as one step up from a notary public certification.
We were with Scottrade for years and they were bought by TD Ameritrade, so the transfer was "semi-seamless". It seems from I have read that the Silver Medallion is Computershare's requirement, is that correct? If it is a requirement of Edward Jones, then I cannot guess what TD Ameritrade would want. Even with the purchase of Scottrade by TD Ameritrade, we still had to fill out the partnership paperwork, mainly because our partnership officer elections happened at the same time. But once you are working with TD Ameritrade, the online services are automatically available. Nothing we did or do with TD Ameritrade has required more than signatures of the partners. We had to appoint a "trading partner", the appointment of whom required a copy of the meeting minutes reflecting that appointment. The initial set up with TD Ameritrade is somewhat tedious and requires a lot of reading and talking to TD Ameritrade to make certain what information they actually want on what line. After that it is simplicity defined.
I would suggest you call TD Ameritrade and see what they say. Whatever they require will be easier and cheaper than what you are going through now.
Peter Dunkelberger
Peter
What did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I'm sorry. You may not know that if you haven't done it but asking just in case you know
Thanks for the info.
Lorna
Sent from my iPhoneBu j y ,g
-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] Computershare
Whoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.
Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment Club
Bob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.
Linda Glein
John,
Thanks. You are the only one who has mentioned ever having computershare. Good to know about TDAmeritrade account. I will look into that.
Lorna
On Monday, March 18, 2019, 08:02:29 AM PDT, M.G. Kademani via bivio.com <user*17485900001@bivio.com> wrote:
We had used Computershare for years for a number of stocks for years. It was convenient when they allowed online access and building a portfolio. About 7-8 years ago they disallowed online access for partnerships, so I transferred each of them to the
club's TDAmeritrade account. It was painless going through the TDA direct transfer process. It was made easier that the account names were mostly similar. No need for Silver Medallion or any other BS.
At this point we do not have any accounts with any TA (Transfer agent). TDA is much easier during tax time and having one place to go for transactions.
I still utilize Computershare for some of my personal stocks, but am slowing transferring those to my TDA account as well when Computershare "improves" their accounts with added fees.
mgk
From: club_cafe@bivio.com <club_cafe@bivio.com> on behalf of LORNA DUCK via bivio.com <user*22851200001@bivio.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2019 1:03 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] Computershare
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2019 1:03 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] Computershare
Thanks Peter! I will.
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
Lorna
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Saturday, March 16, 2019, 7:29 PM, Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com <user*26984900001@bivio.com> wrote:
Hi Lorna,I profess ignorance about the "silver medallion". Except I do know that banks use them as one step up from a notary public certification.
We were with Scottrade for years and they were bought by TD Ameritrade, so the transfer was "semi-seamless". It seems from I have read that the Silver Medallion is Computershare's requirement, is that correct? If it is a requirement of Edward Jones, then I cannot guess what TD Ameritrade would want. Even with the purchase of Scottrade by TD Ameritrade, we still had to fill out the partnership paperwork, mainly because our partnership officer elections happened at the same time. But once you are working with TD Ameritrade, the online services are automatically available. Nothing we did or do with TD Ameritrade has required more than signatures of the partners. We had to appoint a "trading partner", the appointment of whom required a copy of the meeting minutes reflecting that appointment. The initial set up with TD Ameritrade is somewhat tedious and requires a lot of reading and talking to TD Ameritrade to make certain what information they actually want on what line. After that it is simplicity defined.
I would suggest you call TD Ameritrade and see what they say. Whatever they require will be easier and cheaper than what you are going through now.
Peter Dunkelberger
Peter
What did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I'm sorry. You may not know that if you haven't done it but asking just in case you know
Thanks for the info.
Lorna
Sent from my iPhoneBu j y ,g
-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] Computershare
Whoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.
Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment Club
Bob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.
Linda Glein
|
John,Thanks. You are the only one who has mentioned ever having computershare. Good to know about TDAmeritrade account. I will look into that.LornaOn Monday, March 18, 2019, 08:02:29 AM PDT, M.G. Kademani via bivio.com <user*17485900001@bivio.com> wrote:We had used Computershare for years for a number of stocks for years. It was convenient when they allowed online access and building a portfolio. About 7-8 years ago they disallowed online access for partnerships, so I transferred each of them to the club's TDAmeritrade account. It was painless going through the TDA direct transfer process. It was made easier that the account names were mostly similar. No need for Silver Medallion or any other BS.
At this point we do not have any accounts with any TA (Transfer agent). TDA is much easier during tax time and having one place to go for transactions.
I still utilize Computershare for some of my personal stocks, but am slowing transferring those to my TDA account as well when Computershare "improves" their accounts with added fees.
mgk
From: club_cafe@bivio.com <club_cafe@bivio.com> on behalf of LORNA DUCK via bivio.com <user*22851200001@bivio.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2019 1:03 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareThanks Peter! I will.
Lorna
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Saturday, March 16, 2019, 7:29 PM, Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com <user*26984900001@bivio.com> wrote:
Hi Lorna,I profess ignorance about the "silver medallion". Except I do know that banks use them as one step up from a notary public certification.
We were with Scottrade for years and they were bought by TD Ameritrade, so the transfer was "semi-seamless". It seems from I have read that the Silver Medallion is Computershare's requirement, is that correct? If it is a requirement of Edward Jones, then I cannot guess what TD Ameritrade would want. Even with the purchase of Scottrade by TD Ameritrade, we still had to fill out the partnership paperwork, mainly because our partnership officer elections happened at the same time. But once you are working with TD Ameritrade, the online services are automatically available. Nothing we did or do with TD Ameritrade has required more than signatures of the partners. We had to appoint a "trading partner", the appointment of whom required a copy of the meeting minutes reflecting that appointment. The initial set up with TD Ameritrade is somewhat tedious and requires a lot of reading and talking to TD Ameritrade to make certain what information they actually want on what line. After that it is simplicity defined.
I would suggest you call TD Ameritrade and see what they say. Whatever they require will be easier and cheaper than what you are going through now.
Peter Dunkelberger
Peter
What did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I'm sorry. You may not know that if you haven't done it but asking just in case you know
Thanks for the info.
Lorna
Sent from my iPhoneBu j y ,g
-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] Computershare
Whoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.
Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment Club
Bob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.
Linda Glein
AMEN, to what Laurie wrote and advises. I got our club to drop DRIP Investing over a year ago, but we're (meaning me) still dealing with the "sins" of our founder's" nearly 25 years ago, and it "ain't fun" at tax time !
Mike LeAna, Financial Officer
Bulls & Bears Investment Club Club
Sun City Roseville (CA)
On March 18, 2019 at 5:01 PM Laurie Frederiksen <laurie@bivio.biz> wrote:
It amazes me that people still feel they should be doing automatic DRIP investing.
I can tell you that probably 95% or more of the clubs that have big issues at tax time are those that have been doing automatic dividend reinvesting.
It can take hours to untangle the difficult issues that come with mistakes in record keeping for those types of investments. Usually they have gone unnoticed by club treasurers for many years. The more time that goes by, the more complicated they get.
We don't do that work for you for free to untangle them. From many years of answering support questions, I also know that many of you are not comfortable figuring out the issues to do it yourselves. Yet you continue to invest this way.
You also aren't comfortable properly staying on top of all the things that need to be checked every time something happens with your stocks that affect the cost basis of your hundreds of lots of tiny fractions of shares.
If you don't, you have big issues when you sell them and your bivio information doesn't agree with your broker.
An example of problems that arise is the transferring of DRIP accounts to a broker that you have been discussing here. Unless you make sure the DRIP company doesn't provide Average cost basis for each lot to the receiving broker, you'll have match up issues when you sell shares.
You also don't want to transfer shares and combine them in bivio with DRIP investing you were already doing in the same company with the broker. bivio does not track shares by account they are held in. If you do and you sell or transfer shares in a withdrawal, you need to manually make sure the same shares are chosen in bivio that the broker chose. This is not information provided to us by the broker. It is something you need to edit yourself and it is not easy to do.
Many years ago, the hassle of keeping accurate records for DRIP investments may have been worth the savings in commission costs but that is no longer the case.
In the past, there was no cost basis tracked by the broker to show you when you reported a sale incorrectly.
That is also no longer the case.
Staying fully invested does not mean you need to do automatic Dividend reinvesting. The record keeping problems it causes have caused many clubs to close in frustration and many club treasurers to be miserable. That is very sad since the issues could have been easily avoided by just not doing automatic dividend reinvesting.
Laurie Frederiksen
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Click here to Subscribe to the Club Cafe email list. Click here to UnsubscribeJohn,Thanks. You are the only one who has mentioned ever having computershare. Good to know about TDAmeritrade account. I will look into that.LornaOn Monday, March 18, 2019, 08:02:29 AM PDT, M.G. Kademani via bivio.com <user* 17485900001@bivio.com> wrote:We had used Computershare for years for a number of stocks for years. It was convenient when they allowed online access and building a portfolio. About 7-8 years ago they disallowed online access for partnerships, so I transferred each of them to the club's TDAmeritrade account. It was painless going through the TDA direct transfer process. It was made easier that the account names were mostly similar. No need for Silver Medallion or any other BS.At this point we do not have any accounts with any TA (Transfer agent). TDA is much easier during tax time and having one place to go for transactions.I still utilize Computershare for some of my personal stocks, but am slowing transferring those to my TDA account as well when Computershare "improves" their accounts with added fees.mgkFrom: club_cafe@bivio.com <club_cafe@bivio.com> on behalf of LORNA DUCK via bivio.com <user*22851200001@bivio.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2019 1:03 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareThanks Peter! I will.Lorna
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Saturday, March 16, 2019, 7:29 PM, Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com <user*26984900001@bivio.com> wrote:
Hi Lorna,I profess ignorance about the "silver medallion". Except I do know that banks use them as one step up from a notary public certification.We were with Scottrade for years and they were bought by TD Ameritrade, so the transfer was "semi-seamless". It seems from I have read that the Silver Medallion is Computershare's requirement, is that correct? If it is a requirement of Edward Jones, then I cannot guess what TD Ameritrade would want. Even with the purchase of Scottrade by TD Ameritrade, we still had to fill out the partnership paperwork, mainly because our partnership officer elections happened at the same time. But once you are working with TD Ameritrade, the online services are automatically available. Nothing we did or do with TD Ameritrade has required more than signatures of the partners. We had to appoint a "trading partner", the appointment of whom required a copy of the meeting minutes reflecting that appointment. The initial set up with TD Ameritrade is somewhat tedious and requires a lot of reading and talking to TD Ameritrade to make certain what information they actually want on what line. After that it is simplicity defined.I would suggest you call TD Ameritrade and see what they say. Whatever they require will be easier and cheaper than what you are going through now.Peter DunkelbergerPeterWhat did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I’m sorry. You may not know that if you haven’t done it but asking just in case you knowThanks for the info.Lorna
Sent from my iPhoneBu j y ,g-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" < user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareWhoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment Club
Virus-free. www.avg.com Bob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.Linda Glein
Laurie,
No question! A most helpful e-mail below. I'm the Treasurer of a 22+ year club and have been going through this last year and this (needed CPA help 4-5 years ago because of the problem you address, but we didn't change our DRIP process; we are going to in our next meeting ... there's an "or else" attached to that!). Some comments:
1. We started with TDWaterhouse (20+ years ago) which was taken over by TDAmeritrade. They have an online menu pick to get to the Adjusted Cost Per Share (and another column, not used by us, "Adj Wash sale" cost & adj). If anyone wants to see this in your TDAmeritrade acocunt, start from:
My Account page --> Gain/Loss (menu pick) --> Unrealized Gain/Loss (menu pick).
or My Account page --> Gain/Loss (menu pick) --> Realized Gain/Loss (for actual sells) - (menu pick)
I have no idea if other brokers would provide similar information or not, but I would assume so.
2. The information that the IRS gets is from the broker's 1099, that's 'god's truth' to them. Discrepancies between a club's (bivio generated normally) 1065 and the broker's 1099 will show up as that the former (bivio's) is in error and the latter (the broker's) is right. That means the club's 1065 needs to be reconciled with the broker's 1099 (a pain-in-the-tush process, to be sure). I checked with the CPA mentioned above and she confirmed.
3. When we started (1997), the Investment Club philosophy was DRIPs (non-investors learning, needing to start small, high transaction costs mostly, and the notion of 'compounding' without the transaction costs), a wise philosophy at the time and for years afterward. We didn't realize the problems and the complexity that have subsequently emerged (Laurie, you did state it, but I must confess I did not understand how to identify the problems or, certainly, how to rectify them until I barely emerged with my sanity from our club tax process this year and my experience coupled with your subsequently helpful e-mail below).
4. A small item: One member wanted the information in her K-1, Part II, Section L. It can be calculated, but according the the 2018 Instructions for Form 1065 (downloadable from the IRS, and generally useful for any insomniacs reading ths e-mail), p.30, Item L., "You aren't required to complete item L if the answer to question 4 of Schedule B is "Yes." " And, the answer to that question 4 is, for our club, "Yes" (and virtually all clubs I would think?). Bottom line: Not needed information.
5. Another small item: If treasurers get tired of editing out changes, the IRS has downloadable 1065 and K-1 forms that have fill-in boxes (made my life a lot simpler than editing pdf copies, and I could copy and paste member information, etc., fairly easily - it did take some time, but it worked for me; our club has 12 members, smaller perhaps than many).
Jim Snow
On Mar 18, 2019, at 8:01 PM, Laurie Frederiksen <laurie@bivio.biz> wrote:
It amazes me that people still feel they should be doing automatic DRIP investing.
I can tell you that probably 95% or more of the clubs that have big issues at tax time are those that have been doing automatic dividend reinvesting.
It can take hours to untangle the difficult issues that come with mistakes in record keeping for those types of investments. Usually they have gone unnoticed by club treasurers for many years. The more time that goes by, the more complicated they get.
We don't do that work for you for free to untangle them. From many years of answering support questions, I also know that many of you are not comfortable figuring out the issues to do it yourselves. Yet you continue to invest this way.
You also aren't comfortable properly staying on top of all the things that need to be checked every time something happens with your stocks that affect the cost basis of your hundreds of lots of tiny fractions of shares.
If you don't, you have big issues when you sell them and your bivio information doesn't agree with your broker.
An example of problems that arise is the transferring of DRIP accounts to a broker that you have been discussing here. Unless you make sure the DRIP company doesn't provide Average cost basis for each lot to the receiving broker, you'll have match up issues when you sell shares.
You also don't want to transfer shares and combine them in bivio with DRIP investing you were already doing in the same company with the broker. bivio does not track shares by account they are held in. If you do and you sell or transfer shares in a withdrawal, you need to manually make sure the same shares are chosen in bivio that the broker chose. This is not information provided to us by the broker. It is something you need to edit yourself and it is not easy to do.
Many years ago, the hassle of keeping accurate records for DRIP investments may have been worth the savings in commission costs but that is no longer the case.
In the past, there was no cost basis tracked by the broker to show you when you reported a sale incorrectly.
That is also no longer the case.
Staying fully invested does not mean you need to do automatic Dividend reinvesting. The record keeping problems it causes have caused many clubs to close in frustration and many club treasurers to be miserable. That is very sad since the issues could have been easily avoided by just not doing automatic dividend reinvesting.
Laurie Frederiksen
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Click here to Subscribe to the Club Cafe email list. Click here to UnsubscribeJohn,Thanks. You are the only one who has mentioned ever having computershare. Good to know about TDAmeritrade account. I will look into that.LornaOn Monday, March 18, 2019, 08:02:29 AM PDT, M.G. Kademani via bivio.com <user*17485900001@bivio.com> wrote:We had used Computershare for years for a number of stocks for years. It was convenient when they allowed online access and building a portfolio. About 7-8 years ago they disallowed online access for partnerships, so I transferred each of them to the club's TDAmeritrade account. It was painless going through the TDA direct transfer process. It was made easier that the account names were mostly similar. No need for Silver Medallion or any other BS.
At this point we do not have any accounts with any TA (Transfer agent). TDA is much easier during tax time and having one place to go for transactions.
I still utilize Computershare for some of my personal stocks, but am slowing transferring those to my TDA account as well when Computershare "improves" their accounts with added fees.
mgk
From: club_cafe@bivio.com <club_cafe@bivio.com> on behalf of LORNA DUCK via bivio.com <user*22851200001@bivio.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2019 1:03 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareThanks Peter! I will.
Lorna
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Saturday, March 16, 2019, 7:29 PM, Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com <user*26984900001@bivio.com> wrote:
Hi Lorna,I profess ignorance about the "silver medallion". Except I do know that banks use them as one step up from a notary public certification.
We were with Scottrade for years and they were bought by TD Ameritrade, so the transfer was "semi-seamless". It seems from I have read that the Silver Medallion is Computershare's requirement, is that correct? If it is a requirement of Edward Jones, then I cannot guess what TD Ameritrade would want. Even with the purchase of Scottrade by TD Ameritrade, we still had to fill out the partnership paperwork, mainly because our partnership officer elections happened at the same time. But once you are working with TD Ameritrade, the online services are automatically available. Nothing we did or do with TD Ameritrade has required more than signatures of the partners. We had to appoint a "trading partner", the appointment of whom required a copy of the meeting minutes reflecting that appointment. The initial set up with TD Ameritrade is somewhat tedious and requires a lot of reading and talking to TD Ameritrade to make certain what information they actually want on what line. After that it is simplicity defined.
I would suggest you call TD Ameritrade and see what they say. Whatever they require will be easier and cheaper than what you are going through now.
Peter Dunkelberger
Peter
What did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I'm sorry. You may not know that if you haven't done it but asking just in case you know
Thanks for the info.
Lorna
Sent from my iPhoneBu j y ,g
-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" <user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] Computershare
Whoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.
Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment Club
Bob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.
Linda Glein
Three points.
It was painful to move the DRIP and fractional shares from drip management company to our broker, determine the basis, record it and pull it all together when transferring the stock for a Withdrawal. For one stock, and several treasurers before I took over. Just as Laurie said. I lived it. Just say no.
I owned a number of DRIPs during my early investing years. As I grew more knowledgeable, I moved all my DRIPs to shares with a broker. For two years I lived the taxable federal and state events. One of the reasons I divested from DRIPS was I wanted to simplify for me. A second reason was, should something have happened to me, deciphering the spreadsheets and fractional records would have made it very difficult for an executor to file my last tax return. (I observed a complicated situation of that type and simplified significantly to spare my heirs that issue).
I had DRIPs with several management companies (Mellon and ComputerShare and another)and with the self administered companies. At a certain point, the industry consolidated and ComputerShare morphed into the administrator for almost all my DRIPs. I found them particularly arduous to deal with, with ever increasing fees (from when I first started) and user unfriendly policies. (It had been my intent to start nephews investing with DRIPS, but due to the record keeping, I made my gifts in 529 plans instead).
Food for thought,
Irina
AMEN, to what Laurie wrote and advises. I got our club to drop DRIP Investing over a year ago, but we're (meaning me) still dealing with the "sins" of our founder's" nearly 25 years ago, and it "ain't fun" at tax time !
Mike LeAna, Financial Officer
Bulls & Bears Investment Club Club
Sun City Roseville (CA)
On March 18, 2019 at 5:01 PM Laurie Frederiksen <laurie@bivio.biz> wrote:
It amazes me that people still feel they should be doing automatic DRIP investing.
I can tell you that probably 95% or more of the clubs that have big issues at tax time are those that have been doing automatic dividend reinvesting.
It can take hours to untangle the difficult issues that come with mistakes in record keeping for those types of investments. Usually they have gone unnoticed by club treasurers for many years. The more time that goes by, the more complicated they get.
We don't do that work for you for free to untangle them. From many years of answering support questions, I also know that many of you are not comfortable figuring out the issues to do it yourselves. Yet you continue to invest this way.
You also aren't comfortable properly staying on top of all the things that need to be checked every time something happens with your stocks that affect the cost basis of your hundreds of lots of tiny fractions of shares.
If you don't, you have big issues when you sell them and your bivio information doesn't agree with your broker.
An example of problems that arise is the transferring of DRIP accounts to a broker that you have been discussing here. Unless you make sure the DRIP company doesn't provide Average cost basis for each lot to the receiving broker, you'll have match up issues when you sell shares.
You also don't want to transfer shares and combine them in bivio with DRIP investing you were already doing in the same company with the broker. bivio does not track shares by account they are held in. If you do and you sell or transfer shares in a withdrawal, you need to manually make sure the same shares are chosen in bivio that the broker chose. This is not information provided to us by the broker. It is something you need to edit yourself and it is not easy to do.
Many years ago, the hassle of keeping accurate records for DRIP investments may have been worth the savings in commission costs but that is no longer the case.
In the past, there was no cost basis tracked by the broker to show you when you reported a sale incorrectly.
That is also no longer the case.
Staying fully invested does not mean you need to do automatic Dividend reinvesting. The record keeping problems it causes have caused many clubs to close in frustration and many club treasurers to be miserable. That is very sad since the issues could have been easily avoided by just not doing automatic dividend reinvesting.
Laurie Frederiksen
Invest with your friends!
www.bivio.com
Become our Facebook friend! www.facebook.com/bivio
Follow us on twitter! www.twitter.com/bivio
Follow Us on Google+
Click here to Subscribe to the Club Cafe email list. Click here to UnsubscribeJohn,Thanks. You are the only one who has mentioned ever having computershare. Good to know about TDAmeritrade account. I will look into that.LornaOn Monday, March 18, 2019, 08:02:29 AM PDT, M.G. Kademani via bivio.com <user* 17485900001@bivio.com> wrote:We had used Computershare for years for a number of stocks for years. It was convenient when they allowed online access and building a portfolio. About 7-8 years ago they disallowed online access for partnerships, so I transferred each of them to the club's TDAmeritrade account. It was painless going through the TDA direct transfer process. It was made easier that the account names were mostly similar. No need for Silver Medallion or any other BS.At this point we do not have any accounts with any TA (Transfer agent). TDA is much easier during tax time and having one place to go for transactions.I still utilize Computershare for some of my personal stocks, but am slowing transferring those to my TDA account as well when Computershare "improves" their accounts with added fees.mgkFrom: club_cafe@bivio.com <club_cafe@bivio.com> on behalf of LORNA DUCK via bivio.com <user*22851200001@bivio.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2019 1:03 AM
To: club_cafe@bivio.com
Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareThanks Peter! I will.Lorna
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Saturday, March 16, 2019, 7:29 PM, Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com <user*26984900001@bivio.com> wrote:
Hi Lorna,I profess ignorance about the "silver medallion". Except I do know that banks use them as one step up from a notary public certification.We were with Scottrade for years and they were bought by TD Ameritrade, so the transfer was "semi-seamless". It seems from I have read that the Silver Medallion is Computershare's requirement, is that correct? If it is a requirement of Edward Jones, then I cannot guess what TD Ameritrade would want. Even with the purchase of Scottrade by TD Ameritrade, we still had to fill out the partnership paperwork, mainly because our partnership officer elections happened at the same time. But once you are working with TD Ameritrade, the online services are automatically available. Nothing we did or do with TD Ameritrade has required more than signatures of the partners. We had to appoint a "trading partner", the appointment of whom required a copy of the meeting minutes reflecting that appointment. The initial set up with TD Ameritrade is somewhat tedious and requires a lot of reading and talking to TD Ameritrade to make certain what information they actually want on what line. After that it is simplicity defined.I would suggest you call TD Ameritrade and see what they say. Whatever they require will be easier and cheaper than what you are going through now.Peter DunkelbergerPeterWhat did you have to provide to be able to go online. Do you know if I could transfer all of mine from Computershare to TD without getting the Silver Medallion they want. Would TD be able to do a broker transfer! I'm sorry. You may not know that if you haven't done it but asking just in case you knowThanks for the info.Lorna
Sent from my iPhoneBu j y ,g-------- Original message --------From: "Peter Dunkelberger via bivio.com" < user*26984900001@bivio.com>Date: 3/16/19 12:03 PM (GMT-07:00)Subject: Re: [club_cafe] ComputershareWhoa. Those must have been heavy trades. Right now, TD Ameritrade is like $6.95 a trade and they synchronize with Bivio. They have a great online technical support group, and I do not know who our broker is, but I have talked to a few there and they have been super.All of our trades are executed on line with lots of options, like limit trades. You might not trade enough to make a big dent in your budget, but you have to consider value received when one organization charges 25% of EJ's fees for pretty much the same services.Peter DunkelbergerSumner Stock Selectors Investment Club
Virus-free. www.avg.com Bob, I have to admit that $30 was a lot better than I was expecting. My dad's broker charged more like $130 a trade.Linda Glein